Rotax banned from another club 2012.

Mortimer club have now banned all rotax`s from there meetings in 2012 following there AGM. No Exceptions no excusses. all banned.

Thats just what the sport needs..... Who thinks this crap up????

adam wrote:Thats just what the sport needs.....

I agree Adam,, need to sort all the other post 85 stuff now

shepherd wrote:

adam wrote:Thats just what the sport needs.....

I agree Adam,, need to sort all the other post 85 stuff now

+2
Electric start Rotax engines never even existed in 1985.
Neither did Talon wheels, Brembo brakes and Reiger shocks for that matter, but I suppose you could argue that some of the tracks we ride now need decent shocks.

I totally disagree with banning them. I don't understand why just a Rotax? You can stick the electric start back on your XS if its just down to that???Now is not the time to ban anyone in my book...

think your are missing the point here adam (mouth before brain) electric start Yams were out pre 85. but electric start Rotax`s were not. so putting a E-start back on a Yam makes no differance to the engines age.
my opinion counts for nothing but i think they should all race but be scored differant. If we all had transponders, surely you could have a time penalty system. for all the non origonal parts etc. Talon rims 2 secs/ brembo brakes 3 sec. ETC. and Rotax engine 6 sec. deduction from overal time. Making mr x on his 100% norton wasp more competative.
just an idea folks.

im no fan of the rotax or any single motor in the old pre 85 frame...........but butts on seats is what is needed..........allthough i will exspress my views on here that im not a fan of them i would not make a complaint to any officialls at a meating......but they must be getting negative feed back concerning the rotax/singles or there would not be a ban in place.....only thing is if riders start to go for the singles then our ol big engined twinshocks will be obsolete again...i do realise that getting hold of a big engined twinshock is getting harder due to the growth in the sport....the only way it can be done is different classes, twinshock..muti cylinder...twinshock single cylinder

sidekick39ish wrote:think your are missing the point here adam (mouth before brain) electric start Yams were out pre 85. but electric start Rotax`s were not. so putting a E-start back on a Yam makes no differance to the engines age.
my opinion counts for nothing but i think they should all race but be scored differant. If we all had transponders, surely you could have a time penalty system. for all the non origonal parts etc. Talon rims 2 secs/ brembo brakes 3 sec. ETC. and Rotax engine 6 sec. deduction from overal time. Making mr x on his 100% norton wasp more competative.
just an idea folks.

HONEST??? We could also go off in one minute intervals using a time card, We could call it an ENDURO....We are taking aim at our own foot going down this road,,, Get people on the start line it don't matter wat method is used to start the bike..... :%$%$:

The club has taken this route, right or wrong for what ever reason to ban all rotax`s . Four of the 6 Rotax crews have other outfits that they can use, so the club will loose 2 entrys.

So where do I satand with my Honda? Is it a single ban or just rotaxs

I think the clue is in the title Paul ????
if in doubt paul. chat to the Club concerned.

My fear is that the more post 85 bikes & parts used in the pre 85 class will ultimately reduce the number of people using true pre 85 machines,,, which could result in a reduction of pre 85 entries & start of an evo class.
Why not go straight to the evo class and leave well alone.
I sympathise with younger or newcomers to the sport who could pick up a more modern engine than a Norton, Weslake, Yamaha etc but the problem does not stop there,, many older/experienced riders are using post 85 bikes/parts to gain what I consider and unfair advantage over true pre 85 machines,,, lucky for me we don’t seem to have this problem in France and I have the choice whether to ride in UK or not.
I understand the wish to increase numbers but you may increase at one end and reduce at other,,, and you will never keep everyone happy,,,,, life’s a bitch


100% Oldschool

i think to "ban " these machines is a bit much , we need to have a good line up of chairs at these meetings how many times have we lost rides at clubs where the entries have been too low . i think we should all line up together and split the scores/result at the end of the day ie singles / twins irrespective of shocks , wheels and brakes .

is there such a thing as a true twinshock? ricky coles s is a converted mono,dougle s wasp is a converted mono,i wont even start on longmores, can gaurentee the rest ov the paddock are cheating in sum way shape or form parsons using brembo brakes,batt using talons,all the lot on yss and reiger shocks and i think pattison is on interwank, and i ride a lightweight. bugger. how about everyone is banned/ cause the closest one to a true twinshock is pope bodfish bt even he is on electronc ignition now.all rotax s are welcome at our meeting.this nonsense is the begining ov the end for the sport and its bout time people opened there eyes and realised it.

I said this 3 years ago ,and i will say it again.
There should be two classes, that run together.
Class 1: Any bodywork( to allow for alloy tanks), any suspension, any ignition, any air cooled pre 85 motor, two or four stroke. Period frames or new replica frames only( Wasp basically). Must run period wheels and brakes.
Class 2: Any bodywork, suspension, ignition, air cooled motor, twinshock frame (Wolff, KHR etc), brakes , wheels, modifications( long swinging arms, different forks etc)
The same guys would still win.
Oh and the converted mono is a red herring, every one i have ridden handles like shit....

its a good idea but how wud it work when u get the mortimer and pre65 lot who do what the hell they want?the mono shud ov never had to be converted if its pre 85 it shud be ridden as it came out the factory nt choped about with to shut winge bags up

Hello, to make two classes of sides, a classic and a corresponding evolution classic side has what was made has the time(period) (brake driving shock absorber in .......)
Evolution side with (shock absorbers modern, modern brake......)

For distiguer two classify the color of patches has N ° yellow bottom N ° black for classic for évoulutions bottom blue N ° black or other.

Both groups roll it meme time(weather) if there are not enough runners to make 2 series

A debut of idea has to dig



Wasp84

Now that we have all spat our dummys out the pram !!! can we all pick them up plz, they make the place look untidy.
Now if you thought that was bad !!! Wait till you see and read the new goverment guide lines regarding the off road sport of sidecar motocross/classic racing.

still one dummy left on the floor , shaped like a cock. !!!! and its even got your name on it adam, come on pick it up plz.

shepherd wrote:My fear is that the more post 85 bikes & parts used in the pre 85 class will ultimately reduce the number of people using true pre 85 machines,,, which could result in a reduction of pre 85 entries & start of an evo class.
Why not go straight to the evo class and leave well alone.
100% Oldschool

There you go,,, simples,, Leave the pre 85 class alone and start an evo class (pre 90 or whatever you want to make it), both can run together if not enough entries with different colour No plates as suggested by Wasp 84.
It gets bikes/riders on track and when they have enough teams they get their own class,, rules work for all other forms of motorsport (sport in general) why do sidecars have to be different.

Sounds like the perfect solution. !!!!
Right all you Brits, me included, now need to write to the AMCA and get this implicated. its no good wingeing on here as the AMCA do not read this.
Adam and acock, you can ask your mums to write the letter for you.

Fogetting chassis, wheels, brakes, shocks etc, was the rotax engine that is being used about pre 85?

Link to some history from the Rotax website. not sure if this is the answer. ?
http://www.brp-powertrain.com/en/desktopdefault.aspx/tabid-192/328_read-262/

KTM used a 500 rotax motor in 83,, Bombadier maybe earlier,, Armstrong (CCM) took on the 500 rotax motor in 83,, electric start 600s were not out till early 90s.

I cannot remember anyone using one pre 85,, first I saw was Willy Davenport with an Armstrong (rotax) in 86

You may have come across some Shaun, the foriegners were using 600 motors in early 90s, dont know why big fuss about Rotax though,, no different to a big single Honda,Suzuki, Yamaha or anything else post 85,, IMHO of course

To give my 2 pennies worth on the subject, regarding chassis mods, when you look around the pits at the Wasps there doesn't seem to be two the same, so there is no hard rule to say what the chassis should be like. The sport started by making your own chassis to go racing and there were long, short, wide and narrow outfits, you basically made what you could. I remember Mike Holloway having a longer rear swing than i'm using, and if you measured an EML it's not that far off of modern geometry used today, so i don't think you can rule what is right or wrong. Regarding electronic ignition used, it eliminates a lot of break downs that used to occur; regarding Reiger shocks or similar, with most teams using them, it makes racing safer as some of the modern tracks we race on with the big jumps would snap the old Bilsteins or the chassis. Regarding the use of Brembo brakes, i appreciate that it does give one an advantage on the "feel" of the brake, but on longer races the Brembo's fade drastically because of the smaller pistons on the calliper than the Lockheeds, and on several occasions the fluid has boiled in the front brake resulting in no brakes at all. Regarding Talon wheels, i have weighed both Talon and Wasp wheels, and the Talons are slightly lighter, but in my oppinion not enough to give a noticable advantage.
I know that all the above (except frame mods) are not period to pre 85, but in my oppinion are cosmetic and make racing fast much safer.
Regarding the Rotax engines, i do think that if that particular engine was not used pre 85 then it should not be used now. If over time everybody converted to the Rotax,because they're easier to ride and we're all not getting any younger, i don't think it would portray a true likeness of how racing used to be pre 85.
I do think that what our sport does need is a National Championship where we can get full grids instead of some only doing the Welsh or Pre 65 meetings etc.
I know i've put myself up for criticism but it's only my oppinion and don't mean to offend anyone.